First of all, it would have been so much easier to think of a pre-text going to Iraq but why, why make it look that we got bombed or attack by Saudis, Yemanese and Egyptians which in fact is
Joe Rogan: So you’re saying as a motivation
Sam Harris: Yeah, yeah, I mean the general idea
Joe Rogan: That we did it on purpose so that we can go to war with Iraq.
Sam Harris: Yeah if you’re thinking about the source of the false flag operation thesis that we wanted to go to Iraq and steal their oil but then we…
And then we were, perfectly evil and perfectly Machiavellian and it could bring this whole thing off without any leaks to this day and 10 years and no one has come forward and said that this is the part I played and I feel terrible about it.
Uhm and yet we, botched it in these huge ways that we had to go to Afghanistan before Iraq and we really didn’t want to go to Afghanistan. No one suggest that we wanted to be running around Tora Bora and fighting the Taliban.
And we go to Iraq, that worked out well. I mean the idea that was the easiest way to get their oil, uh is crazy. Far cheaper to buy it. Uhm, but
Joe Rogan: It just makes no sense.
Sam Harris: the argument
Joe Rogan: Do you mean we wanted to control Iraq? I mean that we wanted to take over and control their oil which we kinda do now, right? I mean
Sam Harris: But if we just wanted to go to Iraq, to create… Let’s buy the , the idea that people conspire and that actually certain people in our government are willing to, to run our false flag operation so we can go into Iraq.
Joe Rogan: Okay
Sam Harris: What would you have done? You will shut down one of our planes over Iraq and which, we would have never needed that because Sadam was shooting at our planes.
We had a no-fly zone enforced for 10 years and Sadam was, the war wasn’t over as he was concerned. He just kept shooting our planes. He didn’t hit any so let’s let him hit one.
And then we would go in. But it just, killing 3,000 people in downtown Manhattan. People who are well-connected, who, sending our global economy to a tail-spin. It just doesn’t have the right shape of it.
Joe Rogan: I completely agree with you that it will take way too many people to plan it out most likely. And when I look at it I just see, someone’s gonna tell. There’s just too many things that have to be coordinated.
Too many people are gonna start talking. I agree with you that it’s much more likely incompetence. But there was definitely a motivation to go to Iraq.
They wanted to go to Iraq already. It’s something that they had been planning even before September 11th. Looking for motivation. So it’s possible, right?
Sam Harris: Yes
Joe Rogan: That this incompetent government allowed the September 11 to take place and they capitalize on it but why was…
What was their motivation to go to Iraq in the first place? If they weren’t going over there to control the oil and why were they so desperate to go to Iraq? Because it’s pretty clear that they wanted to.
Sam Harris: Well, I think uhm, again to some degree I’m talking out of my depth here because I’m not… I’m not really like a policy guy but the argument which was made publicly at that time by… by many so-called neocons that Iraq was the perfect test case for to create a vibrant democracy in the heart of the air world.
This is basically the educated population. Uhm, we completely underestimated the level of sectarianism there. But again, that’s easily ascribed to incompetence. We just..
We were sending in 23 year old, you know friends of Bush with no expertise at all ‘coz they were the nephew of somebody who donated to the campaign and all of a sudden these people are in charge of some major piece of the machine of how it has created the democracy in Iraq.